conuly: (Default)
conuly ([personal profile] conuly) wrote in [community profile] agonyaunt2024-09-14 04:38 pm

I am so not a fan of The Ethicist

My 78-year-old mother has moderate dementia and suffers from mood swings, depression, anxiety, agitation and disturbed sleep. One of her doctors recommended a low-dosage CBD/THC gummy to alleviate these problems. She takes one daily and, combined with other therapies, now experiences more stable moods and better sleep.

The issue is my mother’s conviction that marijuana is for drug addicts and criminals, never mind that medical marijuana is legal in our state. She is so vehemently opposed to marijuana use that she disapproved when my dying sister used marijuana years ago for pain relief from inflammatory breast cancer. I have to lie to her about the ingredients in the gummies, which I casually refer to as ‘‘multivitamins.’’ Is it wrong to give my mother a drug that she would never have voluntarily taken on her own? — Name Withheld


From the Ethicist:

You think your mother’s attitude toward cannabis is irrational. I agree. Generations of government propaganda have doubtless left a mark. But the fact that your mother’s degree of hostility to the stuff is unwarranted doesn’t settle the matter.

Here are a couple of issues to take into account. One is — no surprise — the extent of her dementia, because it affects her ability to understand what you’re telling her about these gummies. From what you say, she would be perfectly capable of understanding that the gummies contain chemicals extracted from cannabis plants, one of which is responsible for psychoactive effects she regards with disapproval. And long before her current condition, you evidently weren’t able to reason with her about the possible medical benefits of THC. In general, we shouldn’t lie to people about the drugs we’re giving them, and your mother would want to know what’s in those gummies. Mild dementia wouldn’t justify denying her that information. But the more serious her dementia is, the more you have to treat her not as someone whose rational capacities must be addressed but as someone whose care is entrusted to you.

Which brings us to a second issue. When we’re acting in the interests of someone who is no longer capable of making reasonable decisions, we may have to bear in mind not just what we think is best for them but what we know they would have thought was best for them. A person who was keeping kosher before she developed dementia shouldn’t be fed bacon, unawares, because her trustee doesn’t believe in Jewish dietary laws. Even if you judge that your mother has passed the point where she can make decisions, you will still have to decide how central her longstanding hostility to cannabis was to her sense of who she was. And you will have to weigh this against the contribution of these gummies to her welfare. Weighing these issues properly involves having a detailed understanding of your mother’s situation; I hope spelling out the issues helps you to do so.

Link
redbird: closeup of me drinking tea, in a friend's kitchen (Default)

[personal profile] redbird 2024-09-14 09:24 pm (UTC)(link)
A more relevant food analogy would be, suppose a long-time vegetarian couldn't get enough iron from other foods or from supplements, only from meat. Would it be ethical to pretend that a beef burger was a vegetarian imitation?

Also, the LW isn't just lying about what drug they're giving their mother--they're pretending it's not any sort of drug, just a multivitamin. Somehow that feels worse than if the LW told their mother that the gummies were "a new anti-anxiety drug, modern science is so wonderful."
topaz_eyes: (blue cat's eye)

[personal profile] topaz_eyes 2024-09-14 11:01 pm (UTC)(link)
There are 2 competing ethics issues here:

1) Is mom actually being harmed by taking the marijuana gummy? - The evidence suggests no she is not being harmed, and in fact it helps her significantly.

2) Would mom suffer harm if she knew she was taking a marijuana gummy? - The evidence suggests yes, because of her past extreme disapproval she would suffer significant moral harm by if she knew she was taking a marijuana gummy. She would feel betrayed by LW and her doctors, which would lead to trust issues. And that could be very frightening for someone with dementia, not to be able to trust their caregivers; especially as the dementia progresses and they can't remember the reason why, just that they can't trust them.

Since LW has to lie to mom about it, imho that suggests mom still has enough mental capacity to know and understand what she's taking. Imho LW should talk to her doctors to see if there's anything mom could take instead, that works as well as the gummy.
minoanmiss: Minoan lady watching the Thera eruption (Lady and Eruption)

[personal profile] minoanmiss 2024-09-14 11:26 pm (UTC)(link)
This is not the first time I've said "waht the FUCK" while reading The Ethicist. *agrees with everyone's criticisms*

Also, IIRC, isn't CBD isolated because it is NOT the psychoactive part?
purlewe: (Default)

[personal profile] purlewe 2024-09-15 02:39 am (UTC)(link)
I read a book last year about a woman whose mother had dementia. Her mother, a medical doctor who was the top in her field, knew every medication that was known to help with dementia (even tho she was in denial about her dementia) Any time any of her own doctors recommended a drug she recognized the name of and knew why it would be prescribed she suddenly would become fully capable of her faculties and argue with her docs on WHY SHE WOULD NOT TAKE THE DRUG. Finally when her mother became quite uncontrollable in any other situation the doc suggested to the daughter the meds he had been trying to prescribe with the caveat that this was the one time it was ok to lie to the mother. To simply tell her they were a multivitamin. The mom took them eagerly saying that a multivitamin was all she needed. When she went into a memory care nursing home the nurses there told the daughter that it was a common thing to tell their patients it was a multivitamin bc many of them would not take their daily meds. That as long as someone what prescribing and they were administering they would do what the patient needed most, even if it was a small lie.
I think that in this case LW would be fine continuing the story of a multivitamin if it means that their mother was kept in a stable situation. I don't think it is unethical bc I don't think that the parent has the faculties in which to control their health anymore. If this means they are taking something they need but don't understand the need is greater than the understanding.